Friday, November 30, 2012

The church: after that everything changed

More from Hilary on novusordoism:
The damage to the world caused by the abandonment of the Holy Faith by the Catholic Church institution might never be completely calculated by history, nor may its causes ever be completely understood. There is little in human history to compare to it, and there is probably not one area of life anywhere in the world that has not been affected by it, even in those far countries where there is nearly no Christian presence.

It is hard to imagine what could possibly restore it, apart from the Parousia.


  1. I, too, read that yesterday. But it seems to presume the Church has, in some way, defected.

    If I thought that, I'd either 'dox or go back to

    So I'm really not sure what to make of the assertion.

    If it's true, and I'm not misunderstanding, the Church is not now and never has been what She claimed to be.

    If it's false, well, then it's not a significant observation.

  2. Right, I thought of that too. I thought the word 'institution' saved the statement, meaning the church in itself is indefectible but its people and 'institution' in the sense of its machinery (parishes, religious orders, bishops' conferences) are defectible.

    On the other hand, 'I didn't mean that literally!' The Novus Ordo was a mistake but the church didn't defect. The Latin original obviously isn't heretical and the English ordered up by Pope Benedict shows it.

  3. I do see how it could be read that way. Perhaps that is what was meant.

    But "institution" is broad-enough that many use it to include the Divinely-appointed hierarchy and other essential elements that they would like to think, or hope, are optional or defectable.

    If some part of the visible, institutional structure is defectable then I have a hard time understanding how the resulting ecclesiology differs from EO or some Protestant ideas.

  4. I must say that I first read it as Flambeaux did. If that's what it meant, she said it fairly clearly; if our host is right, then she needs some writing lessons.


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