Friday, December 26, 2014

Proposed Catholic pushback against false ecumenism and more

  • On the feast of Stephen. From a sermon by Fr. Robert Hart.
  • Damian Thompson: Pope Francis: despite the glowing headlines, the jury is still out.
  • Fr. Z: KC, MO: anti-Catholic atrocity scheduled before Week of Prayer for Christian Unity. I read in the Kansas City Star (a McClatchy paper) that some “Lutherans” are going to host a sacrilegious, fake catholic (me: vagante) “ordination” of a woman by the usual wymyn suspects. It is to take place at an ELCA-associated Lutheran church on 3 January, 2015 at 2 pm. The end of old-fashioned ecumenism, already passé. This stuff adds to my suspicion that all along, ecumenism was just the Protestant liberals and ours trying to start a new church. It all works one way, right? Protestants think they can tell Catholics what to do or think about our sacraments? On the eve of the Octave for Prayer for Christian Unity, they stick their “F-YOU” finger in our faces, by hosting this farce and sacrilege. Here’s the bottom line. Antics like this should have consequences for ecumenical dialogue. Upon hearing the news that this ceremony is going to take place (or has taken place), the local Catholic bishop must call the pastor of that Protestant parish and say, “I’m the Catholic bishop. Do not allow this sacrilege to be committed in your church. You wouldn’t do this for a group of dissident Jews wanting to ordain rabbis, but we are Catholics so you don’t care what offense you give us. Until an apology is issued, don’t look for us to dialogue with you again.” This won't happen — yet. Give that about 25 years, when the last of the old liberal bishops is gone and conservatives are all that's left in the church, running it again. Note the Star's approving, come-on headline. Note that the liberals who are the story's subject are all old. Also: denominations such as ELCA try to do everything the secular world tells them to; nobody cares what those denominations think.


  1. Why don't these "catholics" just join a church, like the Episcopal Church or ELCA, which claim to be catholic and ordain women?

    1. Because the Episcopalians love high church like I do but Catholic liberals don't, so these liberals would rather invent a church that's a Novus Ordo clone but with women priests. Because of ethnic and real or imagined class loyalty. Because, based on my slight acquaintance with one of this type a long time ago, not only were they were raised to go to church but they were well taught that Catholicism is the true church; their take on that is in practice they don't leave but rather try to change the church. The vagantes in Roman Catholic Womenpriests really think or they pretend they're not leaving the church.

    2. Back in the day, when I followed some of these doings more than I can bear to do now, I had the impression that Catholic girls who were more pious then feminist, but who wanted to get ordained, tended to go ELCA Lutheran, while those who were as feminist as pious, and who wanted to entertain the conceit that they had found a better form of Catholicism than Real Catholicism (*) tended to go Episcopalian, and the misfits, sexually perverse, ignorant, theologically-uneducated-and-proud-of-it, and/or gnosticizers tended to go the vagante route. See (for a case of the first of these) the essay by Patricia Ireland (no, not *that* Patricia Ireland) in this book of Lutheran-to-Catholic convert stories:

      (*) somewhere in Colin Stephenson's *Merrily on High* there is an account of an Anglo-Catholic clergyman leading a retreat uttering the dictum, "RC means Real Catholic; AC Amateur Catholic."

    3. I see your point. Though, not all Episcopalians are "high church." There are low church liberal ones here in San Diego who use rite II of the 79 BCP.

      I've never understood the rub, "Catholicism is the true Church but lets change the church to fit our particular views on (insert desired change)." I want to be transformed by Christ and His Church not to transform it.

    4. Anonymous12:13 pm

      Because they are doing the Devil's work, and are aiming to destroy the Church, in its worship, doctrine and morals.


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